Pernese Dialect in Movie

[Corinth]

I've just finished reading Renegades of Pern and I've gotten a decent ways into All the Weyrs of Pern. Those books talk about how the Pernese dialect has drifted from the dialect of the original colonists. How would they show this in the movie?

If they ever want to make the books with AIVAS into a movie, or really even Dragonsdawn, they may want to show this (if they are looking to be accurate) but it could be very complicated. For one, the dialects are different enough that it is almost a language barrier. This would mean that the Pernese dialect would have to be nearly incomprehensible to the audience. I don't think they would do that, simply because it would reduce the enjoyability of the movie.

Do you think that they would ignore the linguistic problems, or maybe just use different existing dialects/accents to represent the difference?

[Milo]

They will/would use standard modern English, I would assume.

Anything else would be silly.

[Gini_xX]

I thought the movie was based on DF and DQ. If this is the case then they would probably ignore it.

[Mage]

Dragonflight actually tried for the cliche fantasy English dialect; Dragonquest ditched that.

My cynical guess is that they'll try to put on the fake European accent that most fantasy movies use with their characters, even though it would be much preferable if everyone would just act/speak normally rather than make painfully bad efforts to sound elevated in some way. Want a European accent? Get a European actor. Want someone more American or Australian? Okay, go that direction with your actors, and then make absolutely sure they don't do that weird vocal overacting thing that they are prone to doing because it seems like fantasy. I don't precisely know how to describe it; it's just that it's done in almost every fantasy flick ever, except those involving children dragged into a fantasy world. And then the adults still talk like that. It doesn't sound noble. It sounds forced and silly.

[ShadowReine]

Why do we need a special way to indicate dialect? Just the use of terms like 'runner' and 'Hold' will be enough to indicate that they are not speaking 'our' English.

[Vyon]

I would've thought the easiest way to indicate AVIAS's idea of "lingual drift" would be to have AVIAS talking the dialect, not all the other characters. Presumably talking old-fashioned BBC English.

[Mage]

Why do we need a special way to indicate dialect? Just the use of terms like 'runner' and 'Hold' will be enough to indicate that they are not speaking 'our' English.

That is exactly what I'd like to know. But of course, because Pern is fantasy-ish, I'm sure they'll have that crazy Fake Pseudo-British Accent going on. No offense to those of you who actually have a real British or other accent, but when you put a bunch of American actors on a set and they know it's a fantasy film, that's precisely what you tend to get. Only a handful of American actors can properly manage a British accent--or Scottish, Irish, etc. Those of you who are from those nations and regions do it a whole lot better--because it's natural, natch. Maybe it's what the filmmakers want. When they don't do the cheesy faked accents, you still end up with some other odd accent because for some reason, everyone seems to believe that the old-fashioned speech patterns (ever notice that fantasy flicks usually try to pretend at being high-minded by avoiding contractions, changing word order, and using "shall" frequently?) go best with a strange accent. While I'm fully understanding that we don't want to watch actors pretending at being on Pern speaking fully modern English complete with slang, I think it might be wiser to have a more contemporary speech pattern.

[Vyon]

It would make sense. After all, AVIAS is the old one complaining that the language has changed.

Who says the actors have to be American? How about Sir Ian Mckellen for the voice of AVIAS?

[Corinth]

That would be awesome! I think it would fit perfectly. :)

[Ian]

Possibly, though Patrick Stewart has also been mentioned.

I'm not sure what version of Dragonflight Mage has read, but the dialogue in mine seemed no different to any of the other Pern novels to me, other than the general "feel" of the book was different, due mostly to it having been written as a standaolne, & Anne hadn't fully developed Pern's history or culture when it was written.

As far as accents go (and we're really talking about accent here, not dialect, though I suppose words like Turn, Runner, Herdbeast, etc could be classed as dialect since they're a regional use for a word that has another meaning in the wider language), Pern is highly unlikely, even with the best efforts of the Harpers, to only have one. Think how many the US has, or even how many somewhere as small as the UK has (don't like the accent, try the next town ;) ), & the northern continent of Pern is bigger than the US. I find it hard to believe that someone from Tillek would speak the same way as someone from Benden, half a world away, when someone from Leeds has a totally different accent (and dialect, for that matter) to someone from York, no more than 30 miles away.

If any group of people across Pern are likely to have a single accent, it will be the Harpers, since one would assume (although the books never explicitly say so) that they would be taught to speak clearly and with a "neutral" accent, the Pernese equivalent of BBC English I suppose, and for the same reason.

Think about it, Pern was settled by people from various nationalities on Earth (Irish, Chinese, Japanese, Italian, French, Indian, Australian, African, and presumably British, American, & Canadian too, and probably others), when they moved north & founded the Holds & Weyrs one assumes each was made up of people from different nationalities (Ruatha was founded by an Irish family, but it's unlikely that all the first Rutahans were Irish), so accents would begin to intermingle & new regional accents would emerge. Take that forward over 2,000 years, & given the low level of technology & difficulty of long-distance travel for most Pernese & you have a recipe for strong regional variations in accent & dialect.

So, back to the original question, ideally you should have a variety of accents to represent the different areas, but equally ideally none of them should be obviously current Earth accents (no making Meron sound like a New York cab driver, for example ;) ).

[KC.]

^^^^

What he said.

I find it hard to believe that someone from Tillek would speak the same way as someone from Benden, half a world away, when someone from Leeds has a totally different accent (and dialect, for that matter) to someone from York, no more than 30 miles away.


Thinking of someone in particular here me lad :D

When reading Pern I often hear localised irish/british accents on characters - particularly for the holders/holdless ie "normal" people rather than Holders, Harpers & Weyrfolk. :roll:

[Corinth]

Ian: That makes sense. I always thought of the Harpers as having something like a BBC british accent as well. :) And while dragonriders and Harpers would be effective at slowing the changes in accents, they certainly aren't everywhere at once.

KC. : I love your sig! Thoreau is my favorite author. :)

[GHarris]

Possibly, though Patrick Stewart has also been mentioned.


How about Stephen Hawkings? ;) Or at least the computer voice sythesizer that he has.

GH

[Corinth]

I think the voice of Aivas is supposed to be more natural. It's described as being a pleasant voice, and Menolly is really excited to hear him sing, so I imagine he would have a smooth, clear, natural voice.

[GinnyStar]

How about Stephen Hawkings? ;) Or at least the computer voice sythesizer that he has.

GH
<sinp> lol Its made here in USA and uses a American accent, In Nation Geographic: Naked Science: Stephin Hawkings, it tell about the person who created the specal software, figured out and donated it to him.

Also it showed on another something more related to Shellperson than Pern, for they are attacting to the brain controls so people with disibilities can control a computer with there mind, a mouse.

[Ghyle]

(no making Meron sound like a New York cab driver, for example ;) ).

I always imagined Menolly to sound like a New York cab driver, myself.... ;)

[Ryuu]

I always imagined Menolly to sound like a New York cab driver, myself.... ;)Yeah, who knows? Aesthetics could drastically change over the next 3000yrs or so....they could always hire Hank Azaria to overdube the actress' voice (he does Moe from the Simpsons) :whistle:

:evil:

Unfortunately, if it's expected to be just a one- or two-shot movie project, we might not see much of regional dialects displayed as most of the action will be taking place in the Weyrs and major Crafthalls like the Harpers where frequent contact with each other would minimize dialects.

Were this be the case, I doubt that we'd hear much difference in Menolly's accent (her's should be the most far-flung character from the rest of Pern's population), I doubt they'll invest the effort to search for an actress who has a good voice with a noticably different accent. But we can only hope:shrug:

[GHarris]

Yeah, who knows? Aesthetics could drastically change over the next 3000yrs or so....they could always hire Hank Azaria to overdube the actress' voice (he does Moe from the Simpsons) :whistle:

:evil:

Unfortunately, if it's expected to be just a one- or two-shot movie project, we might not see much of regional dialects displayed as most of the action will be taking place in the Weyrs and major Crafthalls like the Harpers where frequent contact with each other would minimize dialects.

Were this be the case, I doubt that we'd hear much difference in Menolly's accent (her's should be the most far-flung character from the rest of Pern's population), I doubt they'll invest the effort to search for an actress who has a good voice with a noticably different accent. But we can only hope:shrug:

Well, if you want to set a baseline of:

Harpers - UK English (and specifically, London)
Caravaners - Irish
Menolly (and her clan) - Australian
Other Sea Farers - New Zealand
Benden Weyr - US English
Ruatha - US English (West Coast accent)
People from the Hills - Scottish
Fort / Healer's Hall - Canadian, eh

;)

GH

[GinnyStar]

Well, if you want to set a baseline of:

Harpers - UK English (and specifically, London)
Caravaners - Irish
Menolly (and her clan) - Australian
Other Sea Farers - New Zealand
Benden Weyr - US English
Ruatha - US English (West Coast accent)
People from the Hills - Scottish
Fort / Healer's Hall - Canadian, eh

;)

GH
Ruatha - Irish for its started Irish?
Something from SoP is ticking the back of my mind on accents. I well have see what I can find.:banghead:

[Old Hippie]

What they could do, as in movies about "Non-English" people is to create a slurred version of English for about two minutes, then switch to the mixed accents we have today. As people started moving out of Fort to make new holds, they may have adopted the accents of the leaders of their group: Red Hanrahan's Irish at Ruatha and Pierre's French at Boll. Just a thought.

[GinnyStar]

What they could do, as in movies about "Non-English" people is to create a slurred version of English for about two minutes, then switch to the mixed accents we have today. As people started moving out of Fort to make new holds, they may have adopted the accents of the leaders of their group: Red Hanrahan's Irish at Ruatha and Pierre's French at Boll. Just a thought. Thanks that is kinda what I was thinking.

Down in southern hot they speak slower, in the heat of the day, there is something about a drawl in other parts of Pern too.